Friends of mine are deeply involved in advocating particular theories about the end of time. They preach, write books, publish newsletters. A couple of different times I’ve ask them, If I believed everything you are teaching, what would I do differently? What do you want me to change in the way I live? Their answer: Nothing.
So why should I listen to their sermons or read their books and blogs? One of the most important questions to be asked in theological conversation is So what? What difference does it make? If the answer is “Nothing!” then at minimum we don’t need to excommunicate each for our differences. I'll push it even further, if a person's theology does not have a vital connection to their everyday life, their theology is a mere religious curiosity not really worthy of the label "theology."
Valuable theology does make a difference in our lives. No, it won’t fix my car. It won’t cure Alzheimer’s or wash the dishes. But then that’s not what it is for. Watercolor painting won’t fix my car either, or cure Alzheimer’s or clean the dishes. Still we treasure good painting. And good theology is at least as valuable as good painting. In fact, theology is a lot like art. Theology is someone’s attempt to paint a picture of reality using words.
Theologians tell us what they see, and they hope that in their telling they will enable us to also see. The eyes of our mind see differently after reading a theological work.
It is important to recognize that theology is not reality, just as a painting of a tree is not a tree. No matter how elegant, attractive or “true” the painting is, the painting is not the tree. The Bible is not God. Calvin’s “Institutes” does not contain God. Ellen White’s Conflict of the Ages series does not contain God. These great works point toward God. They evoke in our minds an understanding and appreciation of God. They help us understand the implications of our God theories for the practice of life. But they are not themselves God.
So why do theology?
1. We humans can’t help ourselves. We are incurable theologians. Even Dawkins has to theorize about God–God doesn’t exist;–he can’t help positing a theory of ultimate reality. When we do theology we are doing what all human cultures everywhere at all times have done. We are expressing and revealing our humanity.
2. Theology has implications for how we order our lives. The respect I give those who disagree with me. The limits I impose on people who use their freedom in ways that damage others. My willingness to cooperate with others in community (preserving and limiting personal autonomy). My behavior in support of personal and community health. All of these things interact with my theology.
3. Theology is the art form most suitable for talking about purpose and meaning. Our lives are immeasurably enriched when they are supported by a lively sense of purpose and meaning. If we did away with formal theology, we would immediately replace it with something that functioned in similar manner in our lives–superstition, philosophy, a different theology.
4. Good theology is beautiful and helps us see beauty. Our hunger for this “divine” beauty has inspired the writing and collecting of books for three thousand years at least. The connection between theology and beauty is so strong it justifies our theologizing even though we know theology can be used in wicked ways. (Of course, we are far better served when we use theology to create beauty than when we use it to crack skulls.)
Theology, even the very finest theology, won’t fix my car. It might help me respond righteously if my mechanic fails or my car is irreparable. It points to meaning and purpose that transcend the entire world of cars and mechanics. No matter how precious my car, theology opens a universe beyond it that invites exploration and worship.
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People are desperate to "prove" their own pet theology, or at the very least generate reams of "evidence". But doesn't this strike at the very idea of faith. If you could prove that god exists you wouldn't need faith. Does this suggest that people don't value faith? or better yet, what exactly is the value of faith?
I like what you are saying Beel, and that works well for the way I think. However, you may be missing the point of the faith experience. For some, like myself, faith is the evidence of things unseen. I can leap from seeing the things around me to "knowing" that God exists without the need for "evidence". That is how my mind works. However, there are some, such as the Biblical writers of Paul, Matthew, and Luke, that feel the need to prove their suppositions and theories that God sent Jesus for a specific purpose.
I learned long ago that everyone needs to be able to connect his or her learning with something their brain already knows. For some people, this is logic. Forget about "established rules" of logic when it comes to faith as faith is specific to that person's experience. Therefore, to answer your question, the value of faith is, in my mind, connecting the person's experience to something larger and more meaningful than their own life. Does that make sense?
"Friends of mine are deeply involved in advocating particular theories about the end of time. They preach, write books, publish newsletters. A couple of different times I’ve ask them, If I believed everything you are teaching, what would I do differently? What do you want me to change in the way I live? Their answer: Nothing."
Usually the point of these groups and their publications is to have you stop reading material from Organization X or paying attention to Person Y, even if, or especially if, they happen to be in the church, which they think is becoming more and more corrupt and deceived by the Devil, who is usually pictured as having inordinate control over people's lives and the particular concerns of historic SDA's.
What a great question! So, I what do you want me to do differently? Just awesome John!
"the value of faith is, in my mind, connecting the person's experience to something larger and more meaningful than their own life."
Tracy, I like this.
Beel, What do you see as the "value of faith?"
Well Pastor, Hell if I know what faith is good for. Like you already said, it can't exactly fix my car. I'd even settle for the dishes. In fact it can't even really make me a better person since there are a bunch of people who don't have any kind of faith at all and still manage to be upstanding people and a lot of people with faith that tend to be stinkers. It seems that the whole bit about being better people is more of a question of choice as opposed to belief. Of course a codified belief system is a far cry from faith itself. And let's be honest, your defintion of theology here is pretty broad. I can understand Tracy at the same time she amuses me. She fully admits that her beliefs have nothing to do with any kind logic, nor can they be examine from any kind of non-emotional perspective. so it sounds to me that her faith is whatever is warm and fuzzy. I don't mean to trivialize her feelings (truly I don't), but it's hard to justify any kind of faith on the basis of Tracy's feelings. In the same vein you loosly define theology as a an artform. Are we going to stick with that? Faith has the same value to people as art? Which is to say that the reason you believe is that it's cosmetically appealing? And my other question still stands. Let's assume for the sake of discussion that faith is fundamentally valuable beyond question. People seem intent, in fact, they seem quite desperate to toss their faith for whatever will do for proof. Which implies that faith isn't particularly valuable at all. So let's not directly assume the value of faith. We can still find a sense of wonder and beauty in the the stars without belief. A sense that is in no way diminished by a space program. This might suggest a redundancy in your Art and Tracy's feelings. Which isn't to say that it isn't personally valuable to either of you. But determining the nature of that value in a more generalized fashion isn't something easily done.
Beel, Would it be fair to characterize your view this way: theological assertions (the content of "faith") are unprovable, therefore they have no value other than the personal benefit/pleasure derived by individuals in their own personal lives?
Would you be willing to give a sentence or two summarizing your view of the truthfulness or utility (or lack thereof) of theology?
Not at all. There are many things in life that are abstract that are valuable. And there is almost nothing that can be "proven" in the strictest sense of the word. It is not MY assertian that faith is unvaluable. It is my observation that people seek proof for their beliefs. And not merely seeking proof, but desperately seeking proof. This seems to contradict their value of faith and I have no idea how to value faith. It is an honest question of mine. As far as theology is concerned, it depends greatly on what you mean by it. you seem to have defined theology as is any description of an existential perspective. Theology in this sense is defined by consciousness. Which I find very valuable. But Truth is funny that way. Those things that are knowable and provable to be true tend to be rather unimportant. Like a priori concepts of Time and Space, they exist but most people don't care that much so long as they continue to exist. And the theologies that people live, die, and fight wars over are by definition unknowable and unproveable. The question i have, is faith valuable in itself or nothing more than a poor substitute for proof?
Clarification...
First, I'm male. Don't worry about this Beel, as most people make that mistake with my name. I only mention this in case that might have an impact on how you view my statement (I hope not).
Second. I'm looking over my statements, and I think you misunderstood me. I didn't say that my faith has no logic, but I was inferring that my logic may not completely line up with your logic or anyone else's established rules of logic. I understand logic quite well, and for much of my life, logic is a basis. My first college major was in Physics, and math ruled a large portion of my life. What I learned through the higher level math and logic courses is that there is so much undiscovered that logic only applies as far as the person's education (e.g. with little formal education, there is little logic, with a great deal of formal education, there is a great deal of logic). Additionally, a person's logic is based on their area of study, and therefore people will see things differently. A simplified example is two people who see a car accident take place. They are both doctors, but one of them is a PhD in Physics and the other is a MD. While the PhD will see the trajectory points, velocity, and can quickly calculate how far the vehicles will travel before reaching him, the MD has a different set of logical points, and immediately jumps into action to assess and assist those in need of his expertise. This is not to say that the MD is better than the PhD, but they do see things differently.
So...when assessing what faith is good for, my opinion (which I am NOT trying to impose on you) is that faith cannot be a one-size-fits-all, just as everything else in life is not one-size-fits-all. God says in Jeremiah that we will find Him when we seek Him. If you would like God to jump out of the clouds and say "here I am", you may be waiting for a while. He has appeared to some, but it is not often, and when He did it was a powerful experience. If you are looking for God to be present in those who claim to represent Him (Christians), you will see it, but only if you look for it. As with most issues, those that tend to shout the loudest get heard and drown out those who's life speak volumes, but quietly. God works through imperfect people.
Tracy, Sorry about the gender confusion. I started the blog with a whole she/he thing but it was bulky and awkward. I figured I had 50/50 odds. Again, my apologies. Actually I think we understand each other pretty well. I understand your need for faith and I didn't mean to suggest that you are an illogical person. I only was referencing your statement that faith can not be analyzed logically. Other people often pick their assumptions from the basis of their own asthetic. And it may be a completely valid perspective that suggests that faith is a purely emotive phenomena. But i find it personally unstatifying. I'm not asking people to prove their beliefs. That's not possible. I'm wondering why they need to. Especially since Pastor equated theology with an artform. No one suggests that we prove that a painting is beautiful or that there is beauty in the world. I find it curious.
Beel, Thanks for you input.
You are right to focus on my comparison of theology to art. When I was younger I thought of theology as close to science--the communal pursuit of truth.
Now, I see theology as closer to art. Artists show us something. We respond or not. The painting/music/fiction connects with our experience (or not). It helps us be more aware of the presence and activity of God (or not).
As a theologian, I am seeking to cooperate with the Holy Spirit in evoking in others an awareness of and appreciation for the person and work of God.
I no longer attempt to prove anything. I don't very often engage in argument. I testify--that is I give witness to what I see. If people find it helpful, that's wonderful. If not, I hope they will find help elsewhere.
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